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> ---
> Total Messages Posted Tue 05/22/12: 3
> ----------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> Today's Message Index:
> ----------------------
>
> 1. 05:44 AM - for interest - float bowl gaskets (William Daniell)
> 2. 05:12 PM - Re: for interest - float bowl gaskets (Bud Yerly)
> 3. 05:47 PM - Re: for interest - float bowl gaskets
> (klinefelter.kevin@gmail.com)
>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 1
> _____________________________________
>
>
> From: "William Daniell" <wdaniell@etb.net.co>
> Subject: Europa-List: for interest - float bowl gaskets
>
>
> For the record an interesting thing happened to me with my zenith which has
> an aftermarket turbo fitted.
>
> Above 11k full power caused vibration - I thought this was just a normal
> "fault" of the aftermarket turbo. Take off from 8500 etc all normal.
> However the problem got worse and manifested itself at lower altitudes.
>
> We put on a vernier to manually adjust waste-gate and the problem showed up
> at higher MP - over 34". Otherwise the engine ran normally. It felt like
> fuel starvation.
>
> New carb vacuum chamber diaphragms, carb balance, full fuel system check,
> fuel pressure - no change. All readings completely normal except for the
> vibration and minor power loss at higher altitudes and power settings.
>
> Just out of interest we changed the carb float bowl gaskets which had been
> changed recently using rotax original parts. We put in after market softer
> cork gaskets because that's what we had. This cured the problem completely.
>
> The conclusion was that the float bowls had been dropped or the mating faces
> had been damaged in some very minor way allowing air to get into the system
> but only at higher differential pressure - higher power settings and higher
> altitude. There was no evidence of fuel leak. The softer aftermarket
> gasket compensated for the minor flaws in the mating surfaces of the float
> bowls.
>
> We spent two days and maybe USD500 solving a problem which was turned out to
> be a 5c gasket.
>
> Will
> Bogota
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of europapa
> Sent: 21 May, 2012 15:51
> Subject: Europa-List: Re: Lack of power with water heated carb body
> mountings
>
>
> Hi,
>
> in the mailing list I can see all of your replies but not here in the forum
> [Question] .
> I am very happy to see so many help by real experts.
> Thank you so much.
> Karl, Craig, Bob, Pete,Terry, John and all the others, thank you so much.
> I am now thinking too that the added heat is not an issue.
> Today I had my prof-check or how do you call it?
> At full throttle and even with my not so light flight inspector the power
> produced by my 912s at high rpm / full throttle was good.
> But when reducing the rpm / throttle the engine became rough like an old
> diesel engine.
> I am rather confused.
> Now I have removed the carbs and will overhaul them.
> If that will not bee the answer I will totally remove the carb heaters to
> see if that will solve the problem.
> If there will still no cure ......... dose anybody wants to buy a very nice
> Europa Trigear...... ( no way! ;-) ).
> More information later, I am really tiered after this long and exciting day.
>
> CU
>
> Juergen
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=373508#373508
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 2
> _____________________________________
>
>
> From: "Bud Yerly" <budyerly@msn.com>
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: for interest - float bowl gaskets
>
> William and all Rotax / Jabiru owners:
>
> At Custom Flight we are having the same problem with the new carb kits.
> Jim Glover had his plane in for major repairs and upgrades. The engine
> sat a while (six months) and we refurbished the carbs with new
> everything for Jim since the carbs had 300 hours on them. We have done
> this numerous times without distress or difficult tuning. The engine at
> altitude began missing. At low boost below 27 inches or low manifold
> pressures under boost, the engine ran great, but when the boost came up
> to 34 inches, going through 6000 ft., the engine went out of tune. We
> couldn't fix it so we had Jim fly down to Lockwood to have them have a
> go at it. They couldn't fix it either after new carb bowls, complete
> teardown and rebuild again. In desperation, Lockwood put two new carbs
> on the engine, tuned it up and it is back to normal at great cost and
> time for the mechanics and owner.
>
> Now suddenly we are having a rash of 914 turbo leaks around the floats.
> N419PL and 12AY have had leaks as have Bob, William and others. A
> turbocharged engine must have proper seals on the bowls and compensator
> for sure to operate properly. Take this as some hard learned advice::
>
> First, do not overtorque the float bowls to seal a leak on the 914, as
> the bowls bend and distort and they are $140 each.
>
> Second, Bing has recommended cork gaskets for the float bowl for all the
> 912/912S engines with the bail clips. This is not sold as part of the
> tune-up kit (normally sold for about $50 with all the O-rings and paper
> gaskets for two carbs). You have to ask for the cork gaskets
> specifically. A Bing Tech at the factory told us that we should be
> using the cork on all the bail clip Bing carbs. Jabiru included. On
> the 914 they still recommend the paper gasket. We are not in agreement
> with Bing on the 914.
>
> We are surprised that it seems that the paper gaskets are just not
> holding up in the 914, especially if it sits a while. So we are putting
> in cork gaskets now as a matter of course on the 914s to see how that
> works. Of course the cork gaskets cost twice as much, but between Kerry
> at Lockwood, Ed and I we are looking at the cork to solve this issue
> long term for leaky bowls.....
>
> Regards,
> Bud Yerly
> Europa Tech Support.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: William Daniell<mailto:wdaniell@etb.net.co>
> To: europa-list@matronics.com<mailto:europa-list@matronics.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2012 8:41 AM
> Subject: Europa-List: for interest - float bowl gaskets
>
>
> <wdaniell@etb.net.co<mailto:wdaniell@etb.net.co>>
>
> For the record an interesting thing happened to me with my zenith
> which has
> an aftermarket turbo fitted.
>
> Above 11k full power caused vibration - I thought this was just a
> normal
> "fault" of the aftermarket turbo. Take off from 8500 etc all normal.
> However the problem got worse and manifested itself at lower
> altitudes.
>
> We put on a vernier to manually adjust waste-gate and the problem
> showed up
> at higher MP - over 34". Otherwise the engine ran normally. It felt
> like
> fuel starvation.
>
> New carb vacuum chamber diaphragms, carb balance, full fuel system
> check,
> fuel pressure - no change. All readings completely normal except for
> the
> vibration and minor power loss at higher altitudes and power settings.
>
> Just out of interest we changed the carb float bowl gaskets which had
> been
> changed recently using rotax original parts. We put in after market
> softer
> cork gaskets because that's what we had. This cured the problem
> completely.
>
> The conclusion was that the float bowls had been dropped or the mating
> faces
> had been damaged in some very minor way allowing air to get into the
> system
> but only at higher differential pressure - higher power settings and
> higher
> altitude. There was no evidence of fuel leak. The softer aftermarket
> gasket compensated for the minor flaws in the mating surfaces of the
> float
> bowls.
>
> We spent two days and maybe USD500 solving a problem which was turned
> out to
> be a 5c gasket.
>
> Will
> Bogota
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com<mailto:owner-europa-list-server@ma
> tronics.com>
> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of europapa
> Sent: 21 May, 2012 15:51
> To: europa-list@matronics.com<mailto:europa-list@matronics.com>
> Subject: Europa-List: Re: Lack of power with water heated carb body
> mountings
>
> <experimental@online.de<mailto:experimental@online.de>>
>
> Hi,
>
> in the mailing list I can see all of your replies but not here in the
> forum
> [Question] .
> I am very happy to see so many help by real experts.
> Thank you so much.
> Karl, Craig, Bob, Pete,Terry, John and all the others, thank you so
> much.
> I am now thinking too that the added heat is not an issue.
> Today I had my prof-check or how do you call it?
> At full throttle and even with my not so light flight inspector the
> power
> produced by my 912s at high rpm / full throttle was good.
> But when reducing the rpm / throttle the engine became rough like an
> old
> diesel engine.
> I am rather confused.
> Now I have removed the carbs and will overhaul them.
> If that will not bee the answer I will totally remove the carb heaters
> to
> see if that will solve the problem.
> If there will still no cure ......... dose anybody wants to buy a very
> nice
> Europa Trigear...... ( no way! ;-) ).
> More information later, I am really tiered after this long and
> exciting day.
>
> CU
>
> Juergen
>
>
> Read this topic online here:
>
>
> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=373508#373508<http://forums
> .matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=373508#373508>
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/Navigator?Europa-List<http://www.matronics.com/N
> avigator?Europa-List>
>
>
> http://www.matronics.com/contribution<http://www.matronics.com/contributi
> on>
>
>
> ________________________________ Message 3
> _____________________________________
>
>
> From: klinefelter.kevin@gmail.com
> Subject: Re: Europa-List: for interest - float bowl gaskets
>
> At the Rotax classes I've attended at Rotech in Canada, Rob and Mike have be
> en recommending the cork gaskets for years now.
> Kevin
>
> On May 22, 2012, at 5:11 PM, "Bud Yerly" <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>
>> William and all Rotax / Jabiru owners:
>>
>> At Custom Flight we are having the same problem with the new carb kits. J
> im Glover had his plane in for major repairs and upgrades. The engine sat a
> while (six months) and we refurbished the carbs with new everything for Jim
> since the carbs had 300 hours on them. We have done this numerous times wi
> thout distress or difficult tuning. The engine at altitude began missing. A
> t low boost below 27 inches or low manifold pressures under boost, the engin
> e ran great, but when the boost came up to 34 inches, going through 6000 ft.
> , the engine went out of tune. We couldn't fix it so we had Jim fly down to
> Lockwood to have them have a go at it. They couldn't fix it either after n
> ew carb bowls, complete teardown and rebuild again. In desperation, Lockwoo
> d put two new carbs on the engine, tuned it up and it is back to normal at g
> reat cost and time for the mechanics and owner.
>>
>> Now suddenly we are having a rash of 914 turbo leaks around the floats. N
> 419PL and 12AY have had leaks as have Bob, William and others. A turbochar
> ged engine must have proper seals on the bowls and compensator for sure to o
> perate properly. Take this as some hard learned advice::
>>
>> First, do not overtorque the float bowls to seal a leak on the 914, as the
> bowls bend and distort and they are $140 each.
>>
>> Second, Bing has recommended cork gaskets for the float bowl for all the 9
> 12/912S engines with the bail clips. This is not sold as part of the tune-u
> p kit (normally sold for about $50 with all the O-rings and paper gaskets fo
> r two carbs). You have to ask for the cork gaskets specifically. A Bing Te
> ch at the factory told us that we should be using the cork on all the bail c
> lip Bing carbs. Jabiru included. On the 914 they still recommend the paper
> gasket. We are not in agreement with Bing on the 914.
>>
>> We are surprised that it seems that the paper gaskets are just not holding
> up in the 914, especially if it sits a while. So we are putting in cork ga
> skets now as a matter of course on the 914s to see how that works. Of cours
> e the cork gaskets cost twice as much, but between Kerry at Lockwood, Ed and
> I we are looking at the cork to solve this issue long term for leaky bowls.
> ....
>>
>> Regards,
>> Bud Yerly
>> Europa Tech Support.
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: William Daniell
>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>> Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2012 8:41 AM
>> Subject: Europa-List: for interest - float bowl gaskets
>>
>
>>
>> For the record an interesting thing happened to me with my zenith which ha
> s
>> an aftermarket turbo fitted.
>>
>> Above 11k full power caused vibration - I thought this was just a normal
>> "fault" of the aftermarket turbo. Take off from 8500 etc all normal.
>> However the problem got worse and manifested itself at lower altitudes.
>>
>> We put on a vernier to manually adjust waste-gate and the problem showed u
> p
>> at higher MP - over 34". Otherwise the engine ran normally. It felt like
>
>> fuel starvation.
>>
>> New carb vacuum chamber diaphragms, carb balance, full fuel system check,
>> fuel pressure - no change. All readings completely normal except for the
>
>> vibration and minor power loss at higher altitudes and power settings.
>>
>> Just out of interest we changed the carb float bowl gaskets which had been
>
>> changed recently using rotax original parts. We put in after market softe
> r
>> cork gaskets because that's what we had. This cured the problem completel
> y.
>>
>> The conclusion was that the float bowls had been dropped or the mating fac
> es
>> had been damaged in some very minor way allowing air to get into the syste
> m
>> but only at higher differential pressure - higher power settings and highe
> r
>> altitude. There was no evidence of fuel leak. The softer aftermarket
>> gasket compensated for the minor flaws in the mating surfaces of the float
>
>> bowls.
>>
>> We spent two days and maybe USD500 solving a problem which was turned out t
> o
>> be a 5c gasket.
>>
>> Will
>> Bogota
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
>> [mailto:owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com] On Behalf Of europapa
>> Sent: 21 May, 2012 15:51
>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>> Subject: Europa-List: Re: Lack of power with water heated carb body
>> mountings
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> in the mailing list I can see all of your replies but not here in the foru
> m
>> [Question] .
>> I am very happy to see so many help by real experts.
>> Thank you so much.
>> Karl, Craig, Bob, Pete,Terry, John and all the others, thank you so much.
>> I am now thinking too that the added heat is not an issue.
>> Today I had my prof-check or how do you call it?
>> At full throttle and even with my not so light flight inspector the power
>> produced by my 912s at high rpm / full throttle was good.
>> But when reducing the rpm / throttle the engine became rough like an old
>> diesel engine.
>> I am rather confused.
>> Now I have removed the carbs and will overhaul them.
>> If that will not bee the answer I will totally remove the carb heaters to
>> see if that will solve the problem.
>> If there will still no cure ......... dose anybody wants to buy a very nic
> e
>> Europa Trigear...... ( no way! ;-) ).
>> More information later, I am really tiered after this long and exciting da
> y.
>>
>> CU
>>
>> Juergen
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Read this topic online here:
>>
>> http://forums.matronics.com/viewtopic.php?p=373508#373508
>>
>>
>> http://www.matronnbsp; via the Web title=http://forums.matronics.com/
> href="http://forums.matronics.com";>http://forums.matronics.com
>> _p; generous bsp; title=http://www.matronics.
> com/contribution href="http://www.matronics.com/contribution";>http://www.m
> atronics.com/c===============
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
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