Kingsley, no problem here and I was just ensuring with the diagram that
everyone contributing had access to the same info.
I think Dave has indicated he has the answer - he might even share what
was causing the problem. =F0=9F=98
Alan
> On 7 Jun 2021, at 12:02, Kingsley Hurst <kingsnjan@westnet.com.au>
wrote:
>
> =EF=BBHello Alan,
>
> I wasn=99t intending to infer the diode should be across the
starter motor as I clearly said starter solenoid in my opening
paragraph.
>
> Without digging a deeper hole for myself, I offer no excuses for the
errors in my posting other than to say my brain was obviously not
engaged properly after 8 hrs of driving today.
>
> Please accept my apology (and you too Dave) for my misdemeanour.
>
> Regards
> Kingsley.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 8:19 pm, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk
<mailto:alanb@dpy01.co.uk>> wrote:
>>
>> =EF=BB
>> <image0.jpeg>
>>
>> The diode is connected across the starter solenoid coil not the
contacts for the starter motor as per the extract from the build manual
above. There is no diode across the starter motor shown in the build
manual diagram, at least not my version.
>>
>> With 12v positive on the starter contacter coil the diode, with the
cathode or marked end of the diode connected to positive terminal of the
starter coil, is reverse biased and so will not conduct. When the
starter button release the falling emf, magnetic field, produces an
opposite voltage in the coil and can spark across the starter switch
contacts eventually damaging the contacts, the diode shorts out this so
the spark does not happen.
>>
>> If the diode is shorted out, or the wrong way round, then solenoid
will not work, assuming the solenoid will operate without diode
connected as a test to ensure it=99s the wiring of the diode
that=99s the problem of course.
>>
>> Isn=99t explaining electrical problems by email
fun.=F0=9F=A4=A9
>>
>> Alan
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 10:44, Kingsley Hurst <kingsnjan@westnet.com.au>
wrote:
>>>
>>> =EF=BBHello Dave,
>>>
>>> I haven=99t got your previous posts in front of me but I
assume you want to put the diode across the starter solenoid.
>>>
>>> If my assumption is correct, you should connect the anode to the
starter motor side of the starter solenoid and the cathode to the
positive (starter switch) side of the solenoid.
>>>
>>> If you have had it connected the other way around and tried starting
the engine, the diode would have been forward biased trying to carry the
full current of the starter motor and more than likely will be ruined.
>>>
>>> Either check the diode with a multi meter ( on ohms scale) to ensure
it conducts in one direction but not the other or use a new diode.
>>>
>>> When connected correctly, on pressing the starter button (or key
switch), the diode is reverse biased and has no effect..... all the
current passes through the solenoid. On releasing the starter button
(or key switch), the collapsing magnetic field in the starter solenoid
tries to induce a high voltage spike but this is swamped by the diode
because the diode short circuits the current induced by the collapsing
magnetic field in the coil.
>>>
>>> Hope this hasn=99t made it more confusing for you. I could
and probably should have just said ..... connect it like the manual
says.
>>>
>>> Best regards
>>> Kingsley in Oz.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 7:17 pm, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> =EF=BBAllan have you put ANODE to switch contact?
>>>>
>>>> Dave Park
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:35, Alan Burrill <alanb@dpy01.co.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> =EF=BBAre you sure the diode is not faulty?
>>>>>
>>>>> You can check it with an meter set to read resistance. Should be
high resistance one way and low the other.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you tried connecting it the other way round?
>>>>>
>>>>> Alan
>>>>>
>>>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 09:02, david park <dpark748@me.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> =EF=BBBud,
>>>>>> Still confused as Europa Manual wiring diagram shows Anode to
Earth? Not switch.
>>>>>> Regards
>>>>>> Dave Park
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 7 Jun 2021, at 01:06, Bud Yerly <budyerly@msn.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> =EF=BB
>>>>>>> Dave,
>>>>>>> I didn't see anyone commented on your diode.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Pretty much any diode will do. If you get it backwards, the
saving grace is the start solenoid is looking for 12 volts. Of course,
the solenoid must be grounded.
>>>>>>> Most mistakes are the ground is left off the solenoid when
putting on the diode. Another problem is guys don=99t insulate
the anode side of the diode and it shorts.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Rotax manual doesn't comment on the diode. But it is an
accepted practice to extend the life of the contacts in the starter
solenoid. The Europa Electrical Chapter 25 advises to use an IN5404
but any will do.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> IN5404
>>>>>>> <image001.png>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> silicone diode is shown above. Anode or plus side is on the
starter switch tab and the cathode or negative goes to the ground bolt
holding on the starter solenoid. I use at least a #18 or 16 wire from
the solenoid fastening bolt to the main firewall ground.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Best Regards,
>>>>>>> Bud Yerly
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>> From: owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com
<owner-europa-list-server@matronics.com> On Behalf Of david park
>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, June 02, 2021 2:44 PM
>>>>>>> To: europa-list@matronics.com
>>>>>>> Subject: Europa-List: Starter Diode
>>>>>>>
<mailto:dpark748@me.com>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I fitted a starter Diode and engine would not start. Orientation
was as described with band end cathode on starter terminal and other end
to earth?
>>>>>>> Have I got wrong diode.
>>>>>>> Any advice appreciated
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Dave Park G-LDVO
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - The Europa-List Email Forum -
>>>>>>> -->
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.matr
onics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42
b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6375825648
12620700%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBT
iI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=d2yFiqBfE8TCD9qLmlbZwUHkZby9t
6u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0
<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mat
ronics.com%2FNavigator%3FEuropa-List&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d4
2b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564
812620700%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJB
TiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=d2yFiqBfE8TCD9qLmlbZwUHkZby9
t6u3YMcNESeUVsc%3D&reserved=0>
>>>>>>> - MATRONICS WEB FORUMS -
>>>>>>> -->
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fforums.m
atronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7
C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnknown%7
CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6M
n0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUhMM%3D&
amp;reserved=0
<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fforums.
matronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%
7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnknown%
7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6
Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=SBC%2BHeUkzr3LiivK88gfvqg0yBuA5ly76yuWCWUUhMM%3D
&reserved=0>
>>>>>>> - NEW MATRONICS LIST WIKI -
>>>>>>> -->
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwiki.mat
ronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C8
4df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnknown%7CT
WFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0
%3D%7C1000&sdata=o8qJjaCYZwDfnYZL5ZTUYwVjcHuo0CD7LEX42XsDfhY%3D&
reserved=0
<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwiki.ma
tronics.com%2F&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d925f6f1c0%7C
84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7CUnknown%7C
TWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn
0%3D%7C1000&sdata=o8qJjaCYZwDfnYZL5ZTUYwVjcHuo0CD7LEX42XsDfhY%3D&
;reserved=0>
>>>>>>> - List Contribution Web Site -
>>>>>>> -Matt Dralle, List Admin.
>>>>>>> -->
https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.matr
onics.com%2Fcontribution&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d92
5f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7C
Unknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwi
LCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2F4PsRd1psVqvnaU7%2FNqFY9pTbwXM%2FA4XO3
8X5pjT4sc%3D&reserved=0
<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mat
ronics.com%2Fcontribution&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4756a189af0d42b6175508d9
25f6f1c0%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637582564812630692%7
CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWw
iLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=%2F4PsRd1psVqvnaU7%2FNqFY9pTbwXM%2FA4XO
38X5pjT4sc%3D&reserved=0>
|